Comments on: The Problem with Ron Paul’s Thinking. http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/ An Unapologetic Traditional American! Mon, 21 May 2012 03:17:54 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.com/ By: Darren http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-1326 Mon, 30 Nov 2009 16:13:45 +0000 http://dgilber2.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-1326 The UN is both corrupt and inept … and has been ignored by every rogue country it has tried to bring into line. Ron Paul has a few ideas I agree with, however isolationism helped cause WW II and Vietnam … that is if you actually look at the history leading up to these two wars and don’t just quote the typical anti-war sentiments popular among liberals and apologists.

]]> By: irishpresidency http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-1325 Tue, 24 Nov 2009 16:15:40 +0000 http://dgilber2.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-1325 Ron Paul understands this, that America inteferring in Saudi Arabia invited the 9/11 attack, your ignorant. And only see your side.

Isolationism is good, the term meaning, stay out of other countries. There is the UN.

]]> By: davide7 http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-863 Fri, 28 Nov 2008 23:47:24 +0000 http://dgilber2.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-863 And what do you think of Mike Huckabee? He is both principled and has a flexible mind.

]]> By: Darren Gilbert http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-515 Thu, 24 Jan 2008 18:30:30 +0000 http://dgilber2.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-515 I always enjoy a stimulating discussion. And … I will accept your invitation to take a closer look.

However, my statement about the invasion was directed at the response to 9/11 and not to other previous world events. We are all well aware of Desert Storm and other occasions when U.S. forces have been called upon. It was not in error unless it is taken out of context.

And yes … sometimes we must simply agree to disagree. It has been time well spent!

Your welcome!

]]> By: Ice http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-513 Thu, 24 Jan 2008 17:27:03 +0000 http://dgilber2.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-513 My final response is located here: My Final Response re: Agree to Disagree

It has been a lively discussion. Let us allow the readers to research the candidates and make their choice. And I invite you to take a closer look at Ron Paul’s position on the issues:

Ron Paul on the Issues

It has been time well spent and appreciated. Thank You.

]]> By: Darren Gilbert http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-511 Wed, 23 Jan 2008 18:22:44 +0000 http://dgilber2.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-511 What is our word as a nation worth? We have a mutual defense treaty signed with the state of Israel. Israel is one small nation surrounded by many nations devoted to her destruction.

There were folks protesting our involvement in WW II for the same reasons you give now … just as there are folks protesting the war in Iraq. I will grant you that they were not as prolific.

U.S. citizens are being blown up in those other countries, just as citizens of many other countries were blown up in the World Trade Center. In today’s world you can not so easily separate the we and them! People are not skunks … there are people out there who will “squirt” you whether you poke them or not … to believe otherwise is simply naive.

I agree!! We must secure and control our borders …. absolutely … no argument from me there!!!! We must end illegal immigration and we must have a way to identify legal immigrants.

There will never ever be a verichip in my hand. The U.N. is a corrupt failure and a waste of American support money, and should be disbanded. The day the UN tells me I have to turn in my gun is the day I declare war on the U.N. I am a proud and free American … and would never relinquish my rights as an American citizen to any other organization, or world government, or corrupted unconstitutional American government. I and about 80 million other NRA members, who support the Second Amendment and the Bill of Rights, work to see to that.

All that being said, we share this globe with many other cultures and ideologies, some of whom, not only disagree with our way of life, but hate us for it. Joseph Stalin, Adolph Hitler, Benito Mussolini, Idi Amin, Saddam Hussein, Osama Bin Laden are simply a few examples of the type of tyrants who despise freedom and liberty because they are concepts that endanger their claim and hold on power. Ignoring them and pretending that they will somehow hate us less if only we would just stay within our borders and not be so damn proud of who we are, is a serious mistake and one that will lead to the end of the United States of America and possibly the beginning of a global tyranny … perhaps a Caliphate.

]]> By: Ice http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-510 Wed, 23 Jan 2008 16:24:16 +0000 http://dgilber2.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-510 And if the woman in your scenario has the right to bear arms she would be able to protect herself… right? But look at the ways in which the U.S. inserts itself into the problems of others. Do you think it proper that the U.S. interferes with other nations as it has been doing (CIA intrigue, “installing” friendly governments, etc.)?

Consider the Middle East: Are you honestly going to stand on the position that Israel cannot deal with the problems in the ME and that the U.S. MUST stick a nose in? Be sensible. Israel has nukes and did bomb Saddams power plant to stop him from gaining such weapons. The problems of the ME should be left to the ME. Israel has proven time again that it can take care of itself. [Meanwhile, McDonalds can move their dollar menu into the area. (You see, if we are not a part of the conflict there wouldn't be any reason for those nations to reject doing business with Americans. And we could purchase stock in McDonalds and profit. Savvy?)]

The call to go to war is still out there. They are not giving up on military conflict with Iran. And it matters not who the next president is (other than Ron Paul) – it will happen… if the economy doesn’t collapse first.

World War II is a different duck altogether. We were attacked by Japanese and the CONGRESS DECLARED WAR. Totally legitimate. But even now I am not convinced that we should remain in either Afghanistan or Iraq. They have suffered for their actions (or inaction: like installing better government than they had) and it is time for us to go. It is not the military’s place to rebuild those nations. Americans are a generous lot. I’m sure that donations would be forthcoming if a case could be made for such.

If other nations want to allow Terrorists to blow up their citizens … what right do you or I have to interfere? But those terrorists are targeting Americans and do it based on U.S. Foreign Policy. Don’t poke the Skunk and he won’t Squirt ya. And you believe that the U.S. Foreign Policy is okay and that poking the Skunk is fine too?

And our backyard is still not receiving the security it requires. The borders are still open and being crossed on a daily basis. What is to stop the religious terrorists from coming into the backyard? Oh, I forgot, our border patrol is busy guarding the borders of other nations … right?

I’m sure that we will have much greater security when every American has a VeriChip in their hand and we can know the movements of every American. American will be safe under U.N. rule and taxation and economically safe with the NAU. While we are at it, why not just throw out the bill of rights? We only have ONE of them left anyway!

The entire discussion should be based on the Constitution and what authority it designates to the government and what authority it retains to the States and the People. Any philosophical argument is moot. At present the very foundation of this nation has been completely undermined and electing any of the other candidates will only lead to the End of America as envisioned by its founders. The rest are all leading America into a one world government and rejecting national sovereignty.

A video that makes the point: Don’t Let Tyranny Take Hold

Ice

]]> By: Darren Gilbert http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-508 Wed, 23 Jan 2008 15:16:22 +0000 http://dgilber2.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-508 That is really funny … the line about Roses and Candy. I liked that.

And I certainly try to live by the “Golden Rule.” Which by the way, is also mentioned in the Koran. Maybe Osama bin Laden should have read it prior to 1994.

While I am not a Bush “yes man,” lets at least be truthful here. Going back as far as 1994, there is evidence that Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden were in contact and working together, especially in the area of weapons development … evidence the “anti-Bush” media frenzy and anti-war democrats simply choose to ignore.

The neighbor murdering his family is the crux of the question! The philosophical point. If I wait and call the police it will be to late … the family will be dead. The police can point the finger and punish the murderer, but they cannot stop it from happening. If I shoot the man attempting to murder his family, perhaps I can save their lives. Which to me is a good thing … something I would hope others would try to do for me. Of course, … many would probably stand up and call me a murderer for shooting the poor misunderstood murderer … and saving the family’s lives.

Just as many, today, choose stick there heads in the sand and say its not our problem! So what if North Korea, Iran, or Iraq gain nuclear armaments … So what if Saddam Hussein murders hundreds of thousands of Iraqi Kurds and thousands of his own people … We should have never went into WW II … Hitler business was Hitler’s business … not ours … We have no business intervening in their problems! What’s six million Jews … more or less? Hell, at least Stalin only murdered millions of his own citizens … no problem for us there is there? I know … lets just build a big steel and concrete wall around the U.S. and let the rest of the world kill themselves off … not our problem!

Rightly or wrongly, Congress surrendered its power to declare war in Iraq when it overwhelmingly voted to pass the resolution granting President Bush the power to use force in Iraq. Has the U.S. Supreme Court declared that resolution unconstitutional? If they do, then I guess I will agree that you have an argument … until then, that resolution stands and is, all verbiage aside, a declaration of war by proxy.

If you consider it right to sit by and simply let Iran, Iraq, or North Korea gain nuclear weapons, to allow terrorist groups like Al Qaeda to indiscriminately blow up innocent men, women, and children around the globe simply because it is not in your backyard, or to let the Taliban or Saddam Hussein spread their stone age totalitarian regimes to other regions; then my friend … you are right … I don’t know right from wrong!

]]> By: Agree to Disagree « The Ice Blog http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-507 Wed, 23 Jan 2008 05:02:30 +0000 http://dgilber2.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-507 [...] Agree to Disagree Darren Gilbert at The Patriot Warrior posted in reply to my response to of his post “The Problem with Ron Paul’s Thinking”. [...]

]]> By: Ice http://patriotwarrior.org/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-506 Wed, 23 Jan 2008 04:41:14 +0000 http://dgilber2.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/the-problem-with-ron-paul%e2%80%99s-thinking/#comment-506 Yes, we invaded after we were attacked. Ron Paul suggested a Letter of Marque and Reprisal. If such a letter had been voted by Congress the world may have seen the last of Osama long ago. And do not attempt to convince that these “religious fanatics” attack us for any other reason then U.S. meddling in the Middle East. U.S. foreign policy is the cause of so much animosity (and downright hatred) of the U.S. across the globe that many would see harm come to us.

However, I’ve leaned more towards military action against Afghanistan but to the extent of absolute destruction and then walking away. And let that be a message to any nation that would act against us or harbor those that would act against us. The war in Iraq is a totally different story.

The very first point we must realize is that only Congress has the right to declare war. And Declare war is what we must do if we are to engage a nation like Iraq. So far we have no evidence that Iraq was involved in 9/11 and Iraq was certainly not an “imminent” threat to the U.S. at the time the U.S. attacked it.

The commercial aspect of relations with other nations is a plus. That falls under “trade”. What makes you believe that we cannot have that if we don’t have a military presence in those nations or some form of military alliance? And wouldn’t you agree that American businesses in other nations are subject to the laws of those nations?

And yes we live in a “global economy” with a fiat currency and a national economy in the hands of private bankers (an elite few). Mark these words: a fiat currency cannot stand and the U.S. will become prey to other nations because it is the weakest of all economies. This we need to change quickly (and I don’t mean with an “Amero” and the NAU”).

It is absurd to even suggest that we have any right to interfere in other nations as we do. Even in Afghanistan, as you mention. The Soviet Union had its resources spread too thin (as we do now) and it collapsed.

If you saw your neighbor chopping up his wife, would you shoot him or call the police? But let me ask a more pertinent question: Do you believe the U.S. has the right to meddle in the politics of other nations? To “install” friendly governments in other nations? This is the sort of meddling that has caused so much hatred for the U.S. around the globe. The U.S. military presence around the globe is a reminder of that meddling.

If the U.S. had no economic problems at home, if the U.S. had been minding its own business, the U.S. would be stronger today than it is. There would be more nations attempting to emulate the U.S. and do business with the U.S. then there are at this point in time. American businesses would not require a military presence in the nations they do business with and American Tourists would be much safer if the U.S. had not been as belligerent as it has been in the last few decades.

We don’t want to trade with Osama either. We want him Dead. But the U.S. military isn’t getting the job done while it rebuilds Afghanistan and Iraq.

Who said anything about ending the VISA system? But answer me this: How is tagging all Americans with some form of National ID going to protect our borders? And if border security is of such great importance then why is there no action to secure it?

Yes, there are evil men all over the world. At one time Osama was a friend to the U.S. So was Saddam. And who is the U.S. now supporting with arms that will one day become enemies? I still say a Letter of Marque and Reprisal would see the end of Osama much more quickly and that we should now turn our back on Afghanistan instead of rebuilding it. They brought the destruction upon themselves. Let Afghanistani’s rebuild their nation. Let the Iraqi’s rebuild theirs.

Yes, John Lennon was shot and killed. But your position on gun control wouldn’t have stopped that from happening. You see, we cannot have roses and candy all the time. There will always be trouble in the world. The U.S. is not the policemen of the world. And the U.S. is bound by the Constitution. The U.S. has its limits which it has been over stepping for far too long, particularly here at home.

It is because I know right from wrong that I disagree with you.

“Do unto others as you would have them do unto you” ring any bells?

Ice
The Ice Blog

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